The Authority Podcast — Expert Insights and Fresh Ideas for Education Leaders

Tasha (00:00.876)
Welcome back to the authority. I'm Natasha Nurse.

Lindsey (00:05.526)
And I'm Lindsay Cannon. And guys, we're so glad you joined us for one of our companion episodes. We're gonna continue our conversation that was inspired by our recent episode with Lainey Rao, the author of Bold Gratitude. And guys, she sat down with us and let us ask her all the questions. And we're so glad to get to share some of our ideas about it with you.

Tasha (00:29.484)
Lindsay, didn't you enjoy the conversation with her? She she is. She's she she just brought so much energy, and and you need that. And and I I was there for it, and I know you were too. But as I was thinking about the the conversation, there's one statement that stayed with me. and Lainey said, gratitude is not about overlooking what's hard. It's about refusing to overlook what is good. So that distinction, Lindsay, it gave.

Lindsey (00:32.448)
She's so fun.

Tasha (00:59.18)
I feel like it gave us like a powerful place to begin this conversation. What do you think?

Lindsey (01:06.912)
Totally agree. I think it is a powerful place to begin the conversation. I think that's well said. And so I know you and I talked about how to use these episodes, and our heart is that our leaders and our teachers that tune in that they would be able to get concrete ideas that they can go and use in whatever realm that they have control and influence over. And and unfortunately in education, there's so much we don't have control over. So we really want to shift our focus for this episode to where do we have control? And I think that is a really

powerful idea of way within that purview that you have, what where how can you elevate what is good? Not that you're, you know, turning a blind eye to what isn't great and what needs to be worked on, but how can you make sure that there's space to celebrate what is worthy of celebration?

Tasha (01:55.064)
Yeah, I agree. Like I I I keep I can't stop thinking about that statement and how much room it made for honesty. Lindsay, we have educators that are so tired. They are so frustrated. They're going through something difficult. And and it's, you know, they're they're going through something difficult and still noticing something good is amazing. So gratitude, it's not asking us to pretend. And that's exactly what Laney was saying. We're not pretending, but

I feel that what it's helping us do is make sure that difficulty is not the only thing that we see.

Lindsey (02:29.793)
Absolutely. Cause that's what cause the quote that I talked about, the Oprah quote, that if we only see those difficult things, then that's what we're gonna see more of. So wherever we put our focus, that's where we're gonna start seeing things. So it is worth it. And I know that Lainey mentioned a lot of the the benefits that are even like our physical benefits that come from focusing on gratitude. So I think it is is well worth it for our leaders to think about.

Tasha (02:52.951)
Mm-hmm.

Lindsey (02:56.513)
And so I know I have at least one idea. What's an idea that you have where a leader could immediately use some of the stuff, whether it's in Lainey's book or just something that she mentioned to us?

Tasha (03:06.177)
Authentic praise. Laney talked about authentic praise and she gave examples of what that could look like in school. And it it made me think how often we say, great job, great job. And we don't attach it to like what was actually great. And then we and when we name what someone did and why it mattered, here's what we're communicating, Lindsay. We're communicating that we truly notice them, that they matter. And that was something powerful that Laney brought out.

making sure you attach, you know, what made that whatever the person did a great job or whatever they're doing, what made it. Give, you know, attach it. Attach it and watch how that person, you know, feels, you know, your gratitude and that you care.

Lindsey (03:51.424)
Yeah. No, I I think that's great. You're kind of actually kind of stole mine, but that's okay. But because I'll kind of add on to that a little bit because yes, we can share it. Well, that means it probably is a really good idea. So do it, leaders. Please do try it. And I would add to that, you all started the year. Any leaders that are tuning in, you started with a plan of things that you wanted to be true in your in your school and that you wanted your leaders to fo and your teachers to focus on this year. And so I would just say, where can you praise, authentically praise?

Tasha (03:55.862)
Okay. We can share.

Tasha (04:02.379)
Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

Lindsey (04:21.013)
those things. So let's say that you wanted teachers to make better connections with students. Well where can you go find examples of that and then use that example that Laney provided us where you're not just saying hey Tasha you're doing a great job but you're like Tasha the other day I saw you pull that student out in the hallway and I saw you really get down on their level and meet them

with where they were in that moment so that they could feel really seen so that you could repair whatever needed to be repaired so we could get back to the learning. And I just want you to know I know that made a difference in that student's life. And if leaders will just, I don't know, set an alarm on your phone and try to do one this week and write it down and just stick it there or stop by and say it to them, whichever one works best for you. And and just have that reminder weekly and just see.

See what good comes bubbling up from that. Because as soon as we receive a compliment, we kind of want to go give one to somebody. So I think there'll be some cool ripple effects in a school with that.

Tasha (05:18.241)
Yeah. It's I I call it authentic gratitude. And I'm thinking about when like leaders do walkthroughs in their buildings and again their their staff develop meetings or when they meet faculty meetings when they meet with their teacher. there could have been so many numerous things that they saw. And can you imagine a teacher, you know, being called out for something that they did in an amazing way? That that will forever change like the way they think about I feel.

you know, what they bring to the table at teaching. And I know that, you know, faculty meetings, Lindsay, they're things leaders have to get through. I get that. I do. But what if we named a few things or started off the beginning of our our our faculty meeting with gratitude. Maybe gratitude moment or what do you think?

Lindsey (06:13.503)
Yeah, that was actually one of the things that Lainey suggested was that just have the book and whenever you have a chance, fill in some, or maybe I don't know if Laney. I think I think Lainey suggested that. If not, I think it's a great idea. but yeah, so the book has all these little examples of little activities that you could do and write in there. So I could definitely see how a leader could just borrow it and then turn it into kind of a group activity. And I think an individual teacher could do that in their class as well.

Tasha (06:26.262)
Yeah. Yeah.

Lindsey (06:42.123)
And so even just getting a couple of copies for your for your staff and and seeing how you could pass it around the building and fill it up with with things that are happening in your building that we are truly grateful for. I because you know we just we've said it several times, so I don't want to repeat too much, but there is always something that's worth celebrating. And I mean, I would I would hate to think of how many opportunities.

there are in buildings day in and day out that could be celebrated that don't get celebrated. And if we just were to able to catch just a fraction of those, I think the the ripple effects could be really powerful. And even though it sounds a little and I am I'm a concrete person. So it sounds a little woo to be like, we're gonna focus on gratitude and then see the ripple effects. But I truly do believe that that it would happen.

Tasha (07:26.478)
Yeah.

Tasha (07:35.243)
And anytime there's like a change or something new that's being implemented, it takes time. But if it's something that we're implementing where we're being purposeful about it and intentional, intentional in a way where we're showing how much we care because we, you know, leaders care about their teachers because we want not only students to win, but we want our teachers winning too. But imagine showing how grateful you are.

For the work they do each and every day day, even though we know that this is our career. You know what I mean? And I I kind of think like I'd walk in feeling so super excited, Lindsay. Like, hey, look, this was noticed at a faculty meeting here, or maybe I got this note in my mailbox. And maybe I walked into work and I just wasn't in a good mood because I had to deal with A, B, C, D. And there are leaders out there doing it, but I love how Laney is very intentional.

Lindsey (08:23.041)
Mm-hmm.

Tasha (08:34.752)
about writing this up in her journal and giving you step by step how you could really implement gratitude. Yeah.

Lindsey (08:41.729)
Yeah.

Absolutely. I know time, time is always an issue. So we've talked about setting a reminder on your phone. We've talked about inside a faculty meeting, just spending a couple of minutes. Where are some other places that could potentially something leaders are already doing, you think, where there might be the potential to layer it on? That's what I I that's my goal for all of our ideas for leaders is where can they attach it to something they're already doing?

So it's not more, it's just more intentionality.

Tasha (09:16.29)
Yeah. Well yeah. I, you know, like we discussed before, they can attach it to a faculty meeting. They could attach it to, you know, we have committee meetings. There are so many opportunities to attach it. And it doesn't have to be long. It can just, you know, be it can take a few minutes, but it has to be done in a way where it feels real to those teachers sitting there receiving it, if that makes sense. what do you think?

Lindsey (09:40.972)
Yeah, absolutely. And it's not just the surface level good job, but the specific thing. an idea I had as you were talking, I I feel like principals are always walking around the building, whether they're going from one meeting to the next or you know, or going to lunch duty or bus duty or wherever.

Tasha (09:53.922)
Yeah, they are. Yes.

Yes.

Lindsey (10:00.0)
They may be going, but just I know I have a transcription tool on my phone. So a good concrete idea might be to get one of those transcription tools. And when you see something, just talk into it and be like, hey, Tasha, on Wednesday, talking to a kid in the hallway and then move on about your day. And then when you have that few minutes to go back, then you have that list. I think you could even you know, loop in your executive assistant and let them help you with turning those into emails that you then look over and send out.

Tasha (10:04.472)
Mm-hmm.

Lindsey (10:29.991)
any way that you can do the work without adding too much to your load because more is not the answer. Better is the answer.

Tasha (10:39.79)
It's a balanced way of using technology because there's also forgot what it's called, an audio similar to what you use, but you can speak into it and send it right to the teacher right away if they're a part of it too. I think it's walk talkie. Forgot, forgot the app. But it's, you know, that is a very intentional way of showing gratitude using technology and teachers getting it right on the spot or whenever they're able to take the time to listen to it.

We got we have to do it. I don't think it's going to get any easier in, you know, the world we live in of education, you know, and it's about making our teachers feel good about what they're doing because we want our students to feel good. And if we're showing gratitude to our teachers, imagine teachers showing gratitude to the students, and I know they're doing that, but you you change your building. You change your building. It's

Lindsey (11:37.44)
Yeah.

Tasha (11:39.18)
I think it's powerful. Yeah.

Lindsey (11:40.93)
Absolutely. And just like the leader that knows that there's several things that they might have missed that they wish they had called attention to in a positive way, teachers feel the same way in their classrooms. We're busy. And so I don't think it is necessarily reinventing the wheel or telling anybody anything they don't know. It's just modeling it so that it becomes part of how we operate here. And that's how you change culture. You don't change culture by making a new policy or making a poster. You change it by

Thinking about what do you want to infuse into your culture and then how can you make it happen more often? And so I think this is a a really easy, easy way to do that. now we talk a lot about teachers. I would love for us to just think for a second about what about the the leader who is they're barely hanging on themselves. How can they use gratitude just for themselves? What do you you have any ideas around that?

Tasha (12:37.26)
Well, I I think about Laney's framework, the notice, think, feel, and do framework. And Laney, she talked about think of one person who helped you recently, right? There's gotta be somebody. I don't care if it was a janitor. Janitors play an important role in a school, in a school, they do. As well as our lunch aides, our teaching assistants. We're one family that supports each other and you can't have one without the other. But Lainey talked about, you know, if you're struggling, think about

why it mattered with what you noticed. The person maybe held the door. The person said good morning. The person smiled at you. And then you do something with that gratitude. If they gave it to you and you received it, can you now reciprocate it? You know, and and there's research or science behind how you end up feeling when that's done. So you you could be in a a horrible situation where you just feel like you're in isolation and you're alone.

And just no one gets you and you're trying your best, but you're drowning.

You've got to find something. I don't care anything that you can hold on to and then you go ahead and and you reciprocate it. And again, it it can, you know, what what do you think? What do you think, Lindsay?

Lindsey (13:55.562)
No, I think I think that's a great point. And I would encourage that leader, you never know how people are going to be when they're tuning in. And I never want them to feel like you've got to go do all of this stuff. So if you're at that point where I'm barely making it in each day, it's hard for me to come back tomorrow. Just really invest in yourself and these practices for yourself for two weeks and just see what happens. And then what did you learn? And then that's what you can authentically then go and take to your staff.

And and then think about them. It's kind of like, you know, putting your your mask on first in the airplane. And it and you can do that with anything. If gratitude's important, if you believe that it's important and you believe it'll make a positive impact, put your mask on first. See how it helps you. And then when you're in a better place, you're gonna be better equipped to go and pour into other people in that same way.

Tasha (14:29.39)
Okay.

Tasha (14:45.718)
And and Lainey said it doesn't have to be elaborate, but it needs to be she says it doesn't need to be elaborate to be meaningful. You just have to take that first step. You know? We we don't want to stay stuck in in what we're dealing with, but there's light and I think that light is through gratitude, or at least that's one way. So

Lindsey (15:05.983)
Yeah. And I'm thinking about the leader right now because I know this happens to me when I'm listening to stuff like this. My brain is just really nice and kind and it loves to flood me with all the times I failed, all the times where I should have shown gratitude and I didn't, or I just missed an opportunity and that kind of stuff. And I just loved that Lainey told us that even though she writes about gratitude, she talks about gratitude all the time and then still forgets to when she was talking about the and you might have to kind of help me with her words there, but when she talked about the

Tasha (15:14.061)
Yeah.

Lindsey (15:35.884)
positive, the amount of positive things you say versus negative things to someone and how even though she teaches about that, when she really looks at it in her house, sometimes with her teens and stuff, she doesn't, we don't do as well as we would like to. So I'd love to speak to that person right now and just one, give yourself grace. And two, remember what Tasha just said that just start somewhere little right now and maybe start with giving yourself gratitude. You showed up, you listened to a podcast,

Tasha (15:40.642)
Yes.

Tasha (15:51.704)
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Tasha (15:57.806)
Somewhere.

Lindsey (16:02.997)
You're trying to think of ideas for yourself and for your staff and celebrate that tiny step that you took.

Tasha (16:09.626)
You know what just came to my mind, Len Lindsay? What about a gratitude jar? Right? Yeah, where where it's low risk and maybe, you know, you write what you're, you know, what you noticed and how it made you feel and put it in the jar. And you don't even have to put your name on it. Maybe for your students. I'm thinking about teachers. You know, we want to teach our students to, you know, love learning, right? And be excited when they come to class.

even though we have to get through standards and curriculum and mandates and all that other good stuff. But what about teaching them about gratitude and then actually doing it? Creating a jar, put it somewhere in the room. Hey, you know, Miss Miller, I learned how to multiply. Thank you. It made me feel like I was smarter. Right? Or, hey, Miss Miller, you smiled at me when I walked in the door and I I I just wasn't having a good morning.

And now I feel way better about myself.

Lindsey (17:09.525)
You know, kids are so great at this stuff. If if we planted that seed and then asked them, they they could actually be really good teachers for us in this way. sometimes it blows me away how sweet and intentional children can be when when we open up the door and give them the opportunity. your jar made me think about on page 47 of her book, she and she has this a couple of times in there, but there's prompts and they're just sentence starters for writing. And so I know writing tends to be a

Tasha (17:36.152)
Love us.

Lindsey (17:39.052)
push in a lot of schools and it tends to be something that we're focusing on. But as a school wide opportunity, everybody like drop what you're doing and and free write about one of the gratitude things. And then you you will have a lot of little examples. And again, I'm always going to be the one that tries to think about what can we tack it onto something we're already doing. And then once we've done it, how can it feed other things that are on our to-do list? And so guys, in this world right now,

Of social media and wanting to have a good presence at your of what's happening within your schools. So imagine if you were hitting a writing initiative, getting feedback that you could give to teachers, because these kids are going to mention teachers by name and their gratitude. And then you can use that anonymously, of course, or with your parent permission on for your social media accounts as well. And to really take that gratitude beyond the the walls of the school and how and you know, and be a within your communities, an example of in that gratitude.

Tasha (18:19.594)
Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Lindsey (18:36.385)
And think about all the boxes you're checking with at. So yeah, I think that could be just so fun.

Tasha (18:41.026)
Yeah, that that that's i it's true. That's even with narrative writing. Page 45. Laney writes about a chain of grateful memories. write a memory you're grateful for, like you said, on each strip and decorate it. You can really spark students. you could spark students or jog their memories with something like this, that they can get on the paper. I I think this is this this will definitely work in a English classroom.

There are a lot of great tips in here and thing and strategies that teachers can actually pull out and use in their class. And like you said, check the boxes. Even though that's not why we teach to check the box, but it's of course things that we have to cover.

Lindsey (19:19.967)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Lindsey (19:25.503)
Yes. But if we can start doing one thing that checks many of the boxes that have to be checked, then and and when I don't think it's bad to use language like checking boxes when we're talking about social media posts and things like that, because those are things that just have to be done. And you know, if we can multi-purpose, multi-purpose, multi-use, layering on our intentionality, that's how you go from feeling burned out and like you never have enough time to feeling like you have some control over your day and some agency.

To build and cultivate what you want to happen in the space that you have influence over. And I hope that people are listening and ideas are firing for them too. And if that's the case, like we want, we want to hear it about it. Tell us, tell us about the ideas that you had. And if you use any of these ideas, please tell us how it went in your school. We want to know how what what were the ripple effects?

Tasha (20:08.066)
Yeah.

Tasha (20:18.146)
Yeah. What worked? What what didn't work? We want to hear it all. We want to hear it all because, you know, again, we are here to to make sure that we share with you what's working and what's not working and and how we can give you the help and assistance through the many authors that we're gonna be interviewing on the authority.

Lindsey (20:40.735)
Absolutely. So, guys, thank you so much for joining us. And if Lainey's message resonated with you, we hope that you'll listen to her full conversation if you haven't already. And think about how you can bring bold gratitude into your school and how you could potentially use her book. And we once again want to thank her for coming and talking with us and thank you for joining us on The Authority.